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April 8, 2009
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I have a new norwich gun with 1:14 rifling as opposed to the monson 1:18.75
at what point did they switch ?
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January 24, 2009
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February 2, 2009
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I have a lightened barrel for my 357Max that has a 1-16 with a left twist as opposed to the original barrel that has a right twist, with a faster twist rate, based on observing both barrels side by side.
April 8, 2009
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44 caliber 10 lands and grooves I wouldn't have noticed but when I took the shroud off it said 1:14 44cal. . the little packet with the fired bullet casing says 1:18.75 but it has a 1:14 barrel , comparing it to my old monson barrels it's obvious that it has more twist .
I dont recall seeing other barrels with the rifling rate etched in
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January 24, 2009
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Interesting. It almost sounds as if it was special ordered...?
December 17, 2008
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Interesting...that's a new twist...
April 8, 2009
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It was on GB its the one that had Quachita county friends of NRA 2001 burned into the barrel . remember it ? sweet gun btw
I read an article written by spotti ? in the archives and he talks about the 41's having 1:18 and he reccomended they drop to 1:14 to better stabilize the bullet . Of course he said it worked !
I haven't shot this one yet but it could be pretty goldarned akrit !
8 inch barrel btw which is 2" above my "cut off" but I couldn't let it go
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February 9, 2009
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I have a 1:14 twist .375 SM barrel. Those calibers were no longer produced in Norwich. Sounds lioke we have a new topic for investigation here. We must get IHMSA 80X80 involved in this one. He probably has some knowledge about twist rates in regards to why different ones were produced and for stabilizing which bullets.
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April 8, 2009
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this is a pic of my monson gun that I bead blasted . the pic was taken in low light .
The bead blasting was done with mil-spec #8 glass bead , line pressure about 90psi
It looks to be a close match to the "dove gray" I've seen on a gun that was on GB .
December 17, 2008
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Interesting. That provides a pretty nice looking finish...
April 25, 2008
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Dusty Trail said:
Interesting…that's a new twist…
DOH!
As far as I know, the original Dan Wesson twist rates were the common ones most gun manufacturers used for those calibers, so the 1:18.75 was standard on the .357SM. Since silhouette shooters have to knock over heavy rams at 200 meters, back in the older days of "tougher" targets, they tried stuffing the heaviest bullets they could find in their cases, trying to get more knockdown power. They tried the 200 grain rifle bullets over the 200 grain pistol bullets, which stabilized nicely, so they could gain a bit more retained velocity at 200 meters. We soon found out the 200 grain Hornady Spire Point wouldn't stabilize in some guns, although their 200 grain Round Nose would.
The IHMSA staff (probably Elgin Gates and Dave Bradshaw) talked Dan Wesson into offering barrels with faster twist rates so these heavy-weight rifle bullets, and even heavier cast bullets would work. Thus came the 1:14 twist for the Supermag.
The same thing applies to the .41 and .4 Magnums. Faster twists were needed for heavier than normal cast bullets. My own 741-V10 won't stabilize the 265 grain Leadheads out past 100 meters. However, my Norwich 741-SRS has a 1:14 twist barrel and it does a beautiful job with those slugs. The barrel IS stamped with the twist rate on it.
I haven't checked the 8" barrel that came with it, but it might be the same twist.
As far as the .375 Supermag, the original barrels worked fine with the 200 and 220 grain jacketed bullets, but again, steel shooters wanted some heavy cast at 235+ grains (I think I saw a 255 grain one somewhere), or even the jacketed ones designed for the larger .375 H&H Magnum.
I don't know when these faster twist barrels were offered in each caliber. I do know Monson made some 1:14 barrels for the .357 Supermag. No clue about Palmer. Norwich offered faster-twist barrels as an option.
The Savantist
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January 24, 2009
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Makes sense, although wouldn't a lower number indicate a slower twist rate? Or am I thinking backwards?
October 26, 2008
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Charger Fan said:
Makes sense, although wouldn't a lower number indicate a slower twist rate? Or am I thinking backwards?
It took me a while to get this down too but twist rate means:
1:14 1 revolution of the bullet in 14 inches
1:18.75 1 revolution of the bullet in 18.75 inches and so on
An interesting little side note my Colt Python with a 1:14 twist shoots the 180gr. Saeco cast bullet way better than my Dan's (715×2 and 40) out to about 100yds. beyond that the Dan's take over not that they're inaccurate with that bullet just the Colt puts em' through just about the same hole. I do have a question for some of you though, My Python gets on average 50 to 100+ fps more than either one of the 715's even with the barrel rubbing on the cylinder(tight in other words)? I have a couple of theories 1. the 1:14 twist 2. Colt uses a shorter cylinder 3. the bank vault lock up of the Colt so the bullet doesn't get disturbed at all before it starts into the barrel. #3 I've kind of eliminated, with the aqcusition of a test fired only still in factory grease 715 (that would be #2) and it was TIGHT. I Chronographed my 715's, 15, smith 686, and the 40 all sporting 8' tubes and nothing touches the Colt in Velocity. hmmmmm?
November 4, 2008
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Interesting. A couple of questions,
What are the barrel lengths of each gun?
Have you ran a bore gauge through them?
If there is any difference in ID, this could explain it. I also seem to remember that the bore on the Colt is factory polished, maybe I am mistaken though. Another theory that someone who knows more than I could dispell would be related to primer ignition. The DW has a transfer bar system, maybe the Colt is providing more hammer strike pressure which results in better primer ignition thus better powder ignition. This one is probably a real stretch though.
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November 17, 2008
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Very interesting. Is that with just the one load or with all loads?
Wisdom is merely the realization of how little one knows, therefore I am wise.
February 2, 2009
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The Pythons and Anacondas did indeed have factory polished barrels. I talked with a Colt rep at a gun show many years ago and he talked at length about Colt barrels and their quest for the smoothest bore possible. I gained both speed and accuracy after firelapping my barrels with a kit from Veral Smith at LBT, his kit uses a fine compound that you roll soft cast bullets into and fire at the minimum vel. to leave the barrel and slugs to test smoothness. It's truelly eye opening, how rough the slugs go through the barrel before lapping and how easy after.
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January 24, 2009
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superdan said:
My Python gets on average 50 to 100+ fps more than either one of the 715's even with the barrel rubbing on the cylinder(tight in other words)?
There is a magazine article on DWCA regarding the direct effect of B/C gap & bullet velocity changes. A wider gap drops velocity dramatically. I bet that if you reduce the B/C gap on your Dans to match the Colt, that the bullet velocity will increase a lot closer to the numbers the Colt is making.
Thanks for setting me straight on twist rate.
October 26, 2008
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they're all 8″ barrels (Python, 715's, S&W 686 and the 40) As for the primer ignition theory, the mainspring on the colt is very weak, combination of old age and somebody's tweaking or over tweaking (I'll raise my hand on that one oopps) it never ignites CCI in DA but does get em' in SA so I don't care who needs to shoot an 8″ in DA. I have not slugged the barrel on anything but the Colt and it was .355 (not a typo) also heard that Colt barrels are tapered so that may explain the .355. All loads have more velocity in that gun even really light .38's do and the hotter it gets the more you seem to get. here's a picture of it, It's actually a Colt model .357 with a Python Target barrel and python hammer fitted to it.
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November 17, 2008
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Not sure why the velocity diff ( probably the polished bore) but sure is a sweet lookin piece. A python is high on my other brands wish list.
Wisdom is merely the realization of how little one knows, therefore I am wise.
June 8, 2009
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Does anyone know what the twist is for the CZ barrels in .22, .357, and .44?
Any thoughts on overall quality? I bought 2 6" .22 SS barrels off their site and both show tool marks inside. Should smooth out, but not like the "Old DW".
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